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tv   NOW With Alex Wagner  MSNBC  February 28, 2014 1:00pm-2:01pm PST

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avenues for more information to come out. >> the new trove of text messages shows more vin tick div languages. >> casual conversation. >> you don't go pick on ran buys. >> making fun of somebody neither one of them likes that much. >> do you find the investigations are a distract n distraction? >> of course it distracts. recent town hall meetings with the governor. >> i have been to two hall meetings in the last two weeks. >> not one new jersey resident -- >> 28 questions. >> not one person has brought up the lane closures. >> not one. >> challenge chris christie to hold the next town hall at temple beth shalom. >> different wheels in motion. >> residents may be waiting for in ex-shoe to drop. >> all the stuff to come out. >> what do you do? grab them by the ankles and shake them upside down? >> the governor will have to explain why he put such people around. >> my job is to be the adult in the room. i have an obligation to tell you all the truth, no matter what. >> nightmare traffic, irate motorists, medical emergencies, today, we are hearing the sounds of crisis in just-leads 911
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calls recorded during last september's surprise four-day closings of lanes leading to the george washington brim. >> somebody hurt? >> that is just a sampling of the 28 hours of emergency calls released today as part of the investigation into what happened during the epic four-day traffic jam now known as bridgegate.
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and while the calls do not counter previous reports that no one died and no major medical attention was dedelayed due to the lane closures, they do help to highlight the very real lives at stake and the striking callousness of governor christie's aides. this is how the bridge entrance looked after christie bridget kelly sent her infamous e-mail timed for some traffic problems in fort lee. and is what kelly and former port authority pointman, david wildstein, were joking about when they messaged one another after wildstein forwarded kell lay plea for help from fort lee mayor, mark sokolich, about kids trying to get to school the middle of the mayhem they created. is it wrong i'm smiling, kelly, replie replied? no, wildstein wrote i feel badly about the kids, kelly said. i guess. they are children of by when know voters, wildstein answered. statistically speaking there is no way that the people in more than a quarter million vehicles that use the gw bridge each day were all voters for christie's
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democratic opponent, barbara by when know as a matter of rather ironic fact, chris christie defeated barbara buono in fort lee by more than ten points. joining me is the host of "up," steve kornacki and from washington, d.c., former rnc chair, michael steel. steve, in terms of changing anything in the investigation, in terms of charges, these calls don't seem to do much. there are a lot of them, we haven't gone through all of them. but they do animate this picture of heartlessness really on the part of christie's aides when they were being approached by government officials who said there are kids who are in trouble here, kids who need to get to school. how damn dog you think this is in terms of popular opinion for -- for and about chris christie? >> i don't know if this in particular, like you said, this illustrate it is in a more dramatic way than some of the other stuff we have h of course, the texts and e-mails have come to light and have illustrate it had pretty dramatically themselves. we can tell just in raw numbers there's been a real significant toll taking on the public
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standingism know his defenders say and he says during -- during -- he said during that radio interview this week, he likes to point out, hey, live two up to hall meetings, no one asked me about this, no one cares about this. his popularity dropped from 70% to 50%. his popularity drops 20% in the last few months. the real danger, not anything that came out today, not anything that came out yesterday with the -- more of the wild steep redactions, it's that there are so many wheels in motion right now in different levels, the legislative investigative committee, the u.s. attorney's office, this internal investigation that christie claims he is conducting himself, all sorts of document requests, all sorts of different media entities, individuals, groups, organization have put out. so there are so many different sources of potential revelations in the next couple of weeks, in the next couple of months. and i think, again, it all comes back to this really exact corner that christie has put himself in, where before january 8th,
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christie says, i had absolutely no inkling of any of. this he has got it clear, all that stuff is still gonna come out for him to -- that position to maintain its integrity, it can be tough. >> you know, michael steel, you were a lieutenant governor. you know about public service. and a huge part of public service is trust in elected officials. >> yeah. >> and you know, those tapes are important, i think, because you know, you literally hear the voices of people who are stuck on the bridge in trouble. and it really does sort of bring this whole thing back to the human element, which is really important, it can get lost in a lot of the details about who did what and when the e-mail its came down the pike but you hear people who are hurt, you hear people who are in need. and it really underscores a certain heartlessness. and i think they may be as damning substantively as anything else that's come to light and to date? >> i think that's an absolute correct point and i -- i know
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that the christie people are very concerned about the perception that sort of compounds the reality that, you know, the president -- that christie didn't have anything to do with it this. >> not quite yet, chairman steele. >> not quite yet. but that christie didn't have anything to do with this. and that becomes less of a problem than the people just realize, well, you personally may not have known, but a lot of your people put us in harm's way. >> mm-hmm. >> and that personal impact, that personal impact statement says a lot to the christie people that i think that they are really kind of worried about that drip, drip, drip, as steve just talked about but more importantly, the impact of what real people feel about what happened that -- over those four days and the administration had a direct link. whether christie did or not, but the administration had a direct hand in the pain that people felt on that bridge. >> yeah. and chairman, i will just say, you know, the most famous 911 tapes we have heard were those
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recorded during flefl september 11th. and these are obviously completely different, but it is the fact that this was going on on an anniversary, the weekend of september 11th. i think for a lot of americans, it's like you hear this again, you hear americans in trouble, you hear americans in pain, you hear regular commuters trying to get where they're going and something's gone wrong and it stirs up, like, i felt it's a very emotional reaction you hear when you listen to 911 tapes, especially on a weekend like that >> well, yeah and the 911 tapes just takes it to a whole other level of understanding, because up to this point, you just had this sort of disembodied environment where there was no real connection and people anecdotally were telling people, yeah, i was sitting on the brim for four hours, whatever. now you are hearing emergency phone calls that are directly related to the tie-up on the bridge and then you layer over top of that the political shenanigans of some really stupid people who decided to
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have fun and games at the expense of all those commuters and this thing takes on a whole different feel for people on the ground, which is why i think the poll numbers may shift a little bit more as these tapes get more airing and people hear that anguish and that anger on the bridge. that's gonna translate in poll numbers and that's something i know the christie people are going to be concerned about. >> you know, steve, the governor finally got a question or a couple of questions at the -- at his ask the governor forum earlier this week. and i want to play a little bit of sound from that because christie's tenacity has not abated at all. let's take a listen. >> i'm not gonna give into the hysteria of questions that are -- that are given by folks who have information today that i didn't have at the time that you're talking about why didn't i ask certain questions. what do you do? grab them by the ankles and shake them upside down till e-mails fall out of their pocket? i mean, come on.
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let's not be hysterical about this. >> let's not be hysterical about this, eric, come on. steve, i, for one, have been shocked he hasn't gotten more questions. i'm also at these town halls, these other open forums, i'm also shocked that that is his response that after all of this the governor has not sort of readied himself in a more composed way to answer this and less reactionary, i mean, shaking people upside down to get the e-mails out of their pockets. no one is suggesting that >> he has got his line that he articulated on january 9th and going to stick to it until and unless it is undercut by further revelations. what is striking to me, talk about how his poll numbers dropped 20 points, obviously, the bridge thing is what's behind that. what it really is i think for the first term, you know, he had as governor, he cut corners sometimes when it came to being completely accurate and honest with his public statement there are times -- he accused -- fired -- somebody accused him of like, the guy hadn't lied at
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all. the public was willing, new jerseygextent, the national public was following give him the benefit of the doubt his first term. even if he wasn't 100% factually correct on this assertion or that statement or that assertion trying to lead the state in a direction, he thought the people they were standing up for with were their friends, they bought into that whole narrative. the very understandable nature, this like the lane closure so understandable to people. >> yeah. >> and the fact that it was in the news this story was perk lagt and growing in the news for four months. i mean, you had this memo from the executive port authority saying state and federal laws were broken that comes in the press october 1st. you had so much suspicious news coverage for months, for christie to sit there at that press conference and insist not until january 8th did i have the slightest inkling i would have something here and for him to say when i fired bridget kelly,
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i did not ask her why. >> right. >> people are looking at everything he says through a lens of suspicion and that's totally different that the past four years. >> chairman steele, when he is asked about why he didn't talk to bridget kelly, or at least in the latest forum, he suggested he knew there could be legal ramifications, which, again, goes to the trust issue. if chris christie thought there was something fishy going on, why didn't he investigate furtherer? why was he already concerned about the legality of things? >> and i think that that is gonna be something that the federal prosecutors, full, are going to want to pursue directly with him. i think that is certainly something the legislative inquirers are gonna want to get details on. as you noted, i have been in that crucible inside the lieutenant governor's office. and we have a snowstorm that is a few hours old, the governor pulls together an incredible team of people and resources to figure out, okay, how do we cheap this up?
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when off four-day-long bridge backup, you have to ask yourself at some point, do you -- do you just posit the question to your chief of staff or deputy chief of staff or somebody in authority, what the hell is going on and why is this happening? and that's the question that i think a lot of people keep stumbling over and having a hard time taking the answers as credible. >> well, governor christie is gonna need one heck of a gigantic plow for this storm. steve kornacki and chairman steele, thank you both for your time. >> thank you. coming up, just between clintons. thousands of newly released bill and hillary e-mails help or hippedary possible clinton presidency, part two? that's just ahead. but first, three countries freeze the bank accounts of deposed ukrainian president, victorian nah cove vich while two armed men seize two airports in crimea. we will have the latest on the situation in the ukraine, next on "now."
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the complicated and bloody past of the ukrainian region of crimea is returning to the president -- present. armed militants have occupied two airports in the region. members of the ukraine's new government say the men were troops deployed from russia but the kremlin is denying those claims. this back and forth comes one day after russian president, vladimir putin, ordered a surprise military exercise on the bored other of ukraine with 150,000 russian troops. the russian flag was planted on top of crimea's parliament building. militants took control of government buildings there and pro-russian demonstrators filled the streets. earlier today in his first appearance since he fled kiev last week, ukraine's ousted president, viktor yanukovych,
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speaking in russian from inside russia, insisted he remained the legitimate leader of ukraine. mr. yanukovych is wanted for the mass murder of protesters in his country. despite russia's overt plex flexing of military muscle yesterday, the kremlin maintains it will respect the serenity of its neighbor. earlier today, secretary of state john kerry urged peace on all sides. >> we urge all parties, all parties, that includes the new interim technical government and rightists and oppositionists and others, anybody in the street who is armed, we urge all parties to avoid any steps that could be misinterpreted or lead to miscalculation or do anything other than to work to bring peace and stability and peaceful transition within the governing process of ukraine. >> coming up, america loves a
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trial. so, why don't we care about what is going on in guantanamo bay? the "miami herald's" carol rosenberg joins me to discuss the gators from gitmo, first, to bill clinton from hillary clinton. thousands of new documents from clintonland. that's next on "now." . ameriprise asked people a simple question: can you keep your lifestyle in retirement? i don't want to think about the alternative. i don't even know how to answer that. i mean, no one knows how long their money is going to last. i try not to worry, but you worry. what happens when your paychecks stop? because everyone has retirement questions. ameriprise created the exclusive confident retirement approach. to get the real answers you need. start building your confident retirement today.
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i will certainly ponder that. >> that was hillary clinton on wednesday giving a non-answer answer to questions about the much-discussed tbd in her twitter bio. as usual, much of clintonworld remains shrouded in mystery, but a few hours ago, america got a peek into the clinton x-files. this afternoon, approximately 4,000 pages of documents from bill clinton's presidency were released including memos from aides to hillary clinton, ones that addressed everything from her failed effort to pass health care reform to the clinton administration's response to early al qaeda attacks. the documents were unveiled under the presidential records act which protects certain documents for up to 12 years after a president leaves office. as the then-first lady embarkeds on her 1939 quest for health care reform, a memo from aide chris jenkins advises clinton to "cut final deals with key interest groups to assure that they are on board when the president announces the
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proposal." but as the process drags on, the tone of the memos begins to change. regarding certain intransigent gop senators, january sing observes, "the finance committee republicans may be a bit more feisty and, aggressive than they would be under normal circumstances. this is because they believe they have not been fairly and equitably consulted on health care." oh, the foreshadowing. other e-mails reveal calculation that went into shaping clinton's public image n a memorandum titled hrc media pos billses from august 1995 ahead of bill clint clinton's re-election campaign, the press secretary writes, "it is clear to me that hillary is most comfortable doing press that is built around a specific purpose. the good press coverage on book tour will give her good political mileage." caputo adds, hillary should own women's media, by women's media, i into than media that reaches women, produced by women and heard and trusted by women. but the best nuggets reveal less
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about the clintons' political maneuverings than how different things were in the '90s, citing former clinton aide and current msnbc host karen finney, "internet has become a very popular mode of communication. hillary could speak to young women through internet." indeed, internet has become a very popular mode of communication. joining me now is the woman mentioned in those -- that correspondence, the host of msnbc's "disrupt" karen finney and from washington, senior white house correspondent for the hill, amy pomerantz, co-author of hrsc, state secrets and the rebirth of hillary clinton. karen, let me start with you since you are mentioned by name when speaking of internet. >> yes. >> right. intertubes. you know, it's amazing, it has been 22 years since the clintons were last -- first elected to office and specifically bill was. >> yeah. >> things have changed a lot. yeah. >> and in media in particular,
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you know, use of internet instead of the internet in a memo reflects how much has changed. i wonder as someone who worked in this sort of media -- the nucleus of the media strategy, how prepared are -- do you feel the clintons are? how much do you think they may have learned about message discipline or messaging more broadly in the interim in the last 20 years? >> think quite a bit. particularly like you pointed out with the health care, i thought those were some of the interesting parts, see so much foreshadowing of what it takes to have a good message and a good rollout of a good strategy, you see that not just from the '93 but the '95 when they tried to come back to it. but also talking about women's needs ya. it's so different now. we don't think to have that way but back then there really was a -- just a small subset, and you notice. >> the five women who were on internet writing about women things. >> that's right. that's right a very different time, a very different time in terms of how we used media, just rereading that memo, which i
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remember so clearly as you were reading it, just how different media is and how we used it so differently. there was really not cable. there was cnn. there was msnbc, but -- >> wasn't the lion that it is today, with both of us as hosts. >> exactly. so it was just very -- it was just so different. and it was much more of a print-based universe. i mean, actually, i worked on her website and it was the first website that a first lady has had and first website that frankly any white house had had frankly. that's how far we have come. >> times done change. amy, you have just written a book about hrc. >> yep. >> i thought it was interesting talking about her relation to, like, they wanted to send her out on a women's media. the question of hillary and women and her sort of favor ability among women is an open ended one. i will read a quote from jane newton small, the head shrine team hillary seeks to woo more young women in 2016 n 2008, hillary seemed unwilling to play up the historic nature of her campaign until far too late in the primary season. her concession speech with its
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mention of 8 million cracks in the glass controlling is the only quote from the campaign where she truly embraced that she could have been the first female president. how much is sort of the feminine mystique, if you will, on hillary's mind these days? >> think it's very much on the mind of hillary and her aides. i mean, we -- you talk about that passage, the 18 million contracts. we have something about that in our book where she was actually really struggling with an aide, two aides the her dining room table about how much to embrace being a woman, a woman candidate and i think if she runs in 2016, your going to see a far different message in terms of embracing women, you know, being that historic campaign, the way that barack obama embraced being african-american. she's gonna do the same thing with women. >> but you know, amie, let me ask you, when we got this sort of data -- data download, if you will, from the clinton -- the clinton years, there was this expectation that there's gonna be some crazy stuff in it.
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>> right. >> and you guys wrote about the clinton hit list, people who were rated on a scale, depending on their missteps and mistakes on the campaign trail or their violations of the clinton code of conduct. >> right. >> there is a sense that they are still counting chips, taking tall love who's up and who's down, who did right and who did wrong. and that i feel like is something they need to deal with ahead of 2016 if hillary does indeed run. to what degree do you think there's an he have fort to have a kinder, gentler, more forgiving team clinton, in pre2016? >> i think that's definitely true. i think that's politics. everyone keeps a hit list, if you will, but i think that, you know, they are definitely trying to present a kinder, gentler, hillary clinton. you saw that, they embraced the text for hillary, for instance. >> instead of firing the aide that first it -- >> exactly. >> or downing the bloggers that posted it? >> really embraced it they
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embrace ready the fact that we saw more images of her drinking beer, dancing. they really want that part to show. you know, when we were reporting and researching the book, one thing i found really interesting was that she really has this wicked sense of humor that she really doesn't let show and i was really surprised by that but everyone had a really funny story about, you know, hillary, the comedian. that's part that i think she is really reluctant to let the public see. >> one of the things i think is the most interesting when you look at these documents or the documents from diane blair that were released is how much the role of women has changed in our culture. remember that hillary really, and the first lady in general, tends to embody so much of our baggage about how we feel about women. in '93, i got in arguments with reporters about the idea that she was somebody who could both handle health care reform around plan a state dinner for nelson mandela. like, and help her kid with her homework, that that was like, what? what do you think your wife does all day? this is what we do. >> i would like to say we have come far from there, karen, but
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i also feel like women, our ideas about having it all are both antiquated and impossible and still the animating factor we talk about women. >> sure, absolutely. i think the way we view women has certainly changed, the idea of a woman president, even thinking about that for 2016, despite what michele bachmann might say, of course, is not -- is a -- thinking about it differently than even we did in 2007, for heaven's stake in 1993, are you kidding me, never thought we would see that i do think it's interesting to see how we have evolved some but you're right, i think women still struggle, we are leaning in, leaning out, moving forward. >> we are leaning forward, baby. >> yes, we are. but still struggling with what that role means and i think part of what all he see in the hillary campaign is kind of a culmination of where we are in 2016, if -- i'm going to say if she runs, of the camp, i don't know if she is going to do it but i think she, of course, will be more comfortable with running as a woman because i think our country is more comfortable with the idea of a woman president.
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>> msnbc's karen finney and the hill's amie parns, thanks for helping me talk about women and internet. after the break it is official, house republicans are set to celebrate a golden milestone next week, the big 5-0, their 50th vote to repeat affordable care act. that's coming up next on "now." these don't look clean. [ doorbell rings ] the johnsons! stall them. first word... uh...chicken? hi, cascade kitchen counselor. stop stalling and start shining with cascade platinum packs. over time, platinum fights cloudy residue 3x better than the competing gel. it's so powerful it even helps keep the dishwasher sparkling. avoid embarrassing moments... at least for your dishes. cascade. beyond clean and shine every time.
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and a hotel is the perfect place to talk to you about hotels. all-you-can-eat is a hotel policy
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that allows you to eat all that you can. the hotel gym is short for gymnasium. the hotel pool is usually filled with water. and the best dot com for booking hotels, is it's on the internet, but you probably knew that. or maybe not, i don't really know you. bellman: welcome back, captain obvious. captain obvious: yes i am. all those words are spelled correctly. call it the big 5-0, a are milestone in the next week as the republicans plan to repeal another part of the affordable care act. this time, the gop aims to eliminate the individual mandate through the rest of 2014 according to house leader -- house gop leadership aide this will be the 50th, yes, the 50th time the house has voted to repeal, defund or dismantle the law. according to nbc news, the bill will likely pass the house and
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then go precisely nowhere in the senate. here's looking forward to 50 more. and this is a live shot looking at the white house briefing room where president obama is expected to make an announcement about the situation in ukraine. we will bring it to you live when we get it. plus, more than 12 years, billions of dollars and just one trial conviction. guantanamo bay is still open. the "miami herald's" carol rosenburg just returned from gitmo. she joins us, coming up next. [ sneezes, coughs ]
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the prison at guantanamo bay is in its its 13th year of operation. 155 detainees remain at the facility and half of these prisoners have been cleared for release. after 12 years, only eight prisoners at gitmo have been convicted, according to the aclu, all of this costs the american taxpayer roughly half a billion dollars a year. and yet, despite these
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inefficiencies and injustices, despite the black mark that remains on the american justice system, deet tension facility at guantanamo bay is still open. this week, the general responsible for overseeing the detention center, marine general john kelly, told congress that a secret prison within gitmo, one that houses high-value detainees like 9/11 mastermind, khalid sheikh mohammed, the general announced that prize sun falling apart n a testimony to the house armed services committee, general kelly wrote that the expeditionary infrastructure put in place was intended to be temporary and numerous facilities have showing signs of deterioration and require frequent repair. intended to be temporary and yet here we are, 12 years later, repairing infrastructure indefinitely. since 9/11, more than 500 terrorism suspects have been prosecuted in federal court, but gitmo hasn't seen anywhere even close to that same success. instead, the trials at guilty mow are what "the new yorker's" amy davidson call bizarre
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exercises in legal improv, ones that are "embarrassing to watch." no one seems to know the basic rules for the trials. prosecutors are adding charges they are unsure can even be tried in a military commission. and some evidence can't be used because it was obtained through torture n protest of their situation and many cases their indefinite detention, last march, a group of detainees at gitmo began a hunger strike. at one point, over 100 prisoners were taking part. several months ago, for no apparent reason other than to enhance see kress circumstance the prison stopped reporting on how many of the prisoners were refusing to eat. on january 29th, the most recent reporting available, the "miami herald" estimated that 25 prisoners were still on hunger strike. joining me now is the senior journalist at the "miami hera " herald", carol rosenburg who just returned from reporting at guantanamo bay. carol, thanks for joining the program. i think a lot of people are surprised that anybody is still on hunger strike at gitmo.
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what do you think led to this added secrecy? was it the media coverage and the uncomfortable motion position that the gitmo gardens find themselves in with regards to force feeding? >> well, they definitely did not like the coverage, but i think that the generals believe that the detainees were hunger striking to the coverage. in other words, the numbers had become a story in and of itself. i don't agree with the blackout. i think it's -- offers one of the few windows into what's going on at guantanamo and when they shut off the numbers in december, they really did draw a curtain on transparency at guantanamo. but from the military point of view, they felt that some of the detainees were participating in the hunger strike because of the coverage. and remember why they started the hunger strike. it was frustration with their status as indefinite detainees and the sense that nobody was noticing, nobody was paying attention. so, it's this cycle, right? they go on a strike, we report it, they get attention, the
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president speaks to it and then the general, at some point, decides enough coverage. >> right. >> doesn't like the coverage. >> you know, carol, amy in that piece in ""the new yorker,"" you are really the only reporter down there covers some of these trials and certainly the blackout and other ways in which the -- those who manage gitmo have made it difficult to report that do nothing to increase coverage but i also -- she makes the -- i think very fair point that the american audience has not seemed particularly interested in what's going on down there and talks about the question of al qaeda and i will read just an excerpt from amy's post, the name al qaeda is still stimulating, but only when with benghazi or on the phone to americans. when it come to a prisoner and proceedings or lack of them against him, al qaeda seems to have a somnolent quality.
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have you been surprised? one of the few journalists down there that you have little company? >> well, amy wrote that last week because i was the only reporter who showed up for a hearing, a pretrial hearing in the case of the "uss cole," the alleged bomber. and i want to push back a little bit. people do care. the september 11th families do care. i know this because they write me and they read my twitter stream and, you know, the families of the these sailors who were killed in the "uss cole" bombing tell me they goes on the website and read the stories, but this is hard stuff. this is ex post facto hear say t -- here say, for people disappeared for four years into the cia black sites for four years, three years without an attorney and now there's dry, legal arguments. the case with the "uss cole" bombing in october 2000, but we heard -- what we heard last week was not about the victims, not about al qaeda, not about suicide bombing, but about which
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pieces of the constitution will apply down at this commission. these are defense lawyers trying to chip away at a death penalty case to say to the judge, if you hide a percentage of the evidence from the accused, if we, the defense lawyers, can't tell the accused some of the secret evidence, how can you then go about and ask for a death penalty? so, this is the pretrial hearings. it's hard. it isn't that kind of sexy murder trials that americans have become accustomed to watching on court tv. >> and carl, i'm not gonna argue with -- of course the families of the victims care, but i do think in terms of the breadth of coverage, the amount of discussion, these are people -- khalid sheikh mohammed, enemy combatants, number one, names familiar to many americans. if you ask i think john q. public where ksm's trial stands in terms of proceedings, i think very few people would be able to
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answer you on that on that note, the speed or lack thereof with which these men are seeing trial is staggering. the average wait time between a federal court around military commission, 1.5 years the average wait time for a federal court trial. military commissions take up to 7.6 years. i mean, given that, given that and given the difficulty at hand in terms of letting some of these guys go who have not been charged with anything, i mean, are we any closer to closing this? we talked about camp 7, which you've written about extensively. this was intended to be temporary structure. they are gonna have to make repairs to it because it doesn't look like it's going to close any time soon. >> it's absolutely not gonna close any time soon. last week, they took a guilty plea from a man who is going to spend four more years in custody, presumably at guantanamo. after that, he gets to go back to saudi arabia. four more years, there will be a new president. if that man is still at
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guantanamo, the president didn't make good at his promise. but i won't be alone at guantanamo covering hearings when they get to what the military calls the case in chief, the trial. when they start talking about what happened on september 11th, every reporter slot will be full down there this is the early part. i understand that it's frustrating to people, thank it's taken so long. they didn't capture these men and take them straight to a court. they took them to the ci a black sites for three and four years, where they interrogated them. these men who are on trial now, they were captured in 2002 and 2003. they didn't get to guantanamo until 2006 and then -- and then they needed to actually create the law to have this new kind of court. a new kind of court means a lot of pretrial proceedings. >> yes, you know, and carol, in fairness, it is incredibly legalistically thorny thing happening down there all the
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more reason to be could have tefrmg thank you so much for your time, the "miami herald's" carol rosenberg. thank you again. >> thank you. we are waiting for president obama to speak in the white house briefing room about ukraine in just a few moments. joining us now nbc news white house correspondent kristen welker. give us a sense, do we have any sense of what the president may say here? >> i think he is going to reiterate potential any stronger term what is we have heard from this administration over the past several days, which is that russia should not intervene in ukraine. and of course this comes as we are getting reports from ukrainian officials that russian forces, russian helicopters, transport vehicles, have entered ukraine. in fact, one official saying that russian officials have actually taken over ukraine's or crimea's main airport. u.s. officials telling nbc news they have no reason to doubt what officials in ukraine are saying. obviously, monitoring this situation quite closely, you
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will recall that susan rice the national security adviser, said last week that if russia were to intervene, it would be a grave mistake. strong words all week long from this administration. secretary kerry saying today that he spoke with russia's foreign minister, sergei lavrov, earlier today, again telling russia not to engage. so, that is what we have been hearing all along. president obama will undoubtedly come out with some stern words. what he will say specifically, we'll have to wait and see, but of course, earlier today, the former president of ukraine, yanukovych, has not been deposed he still leads himself as the leader of ukraine, despite the fact that many do not see the situation in that light. so president obama will come out. i expect him to have strong words from russia. clearly, this situation and russia entering that space only increasing tensions between the east and the west, between the
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united states and russia. u.s. officials have said all week long that this is not a return to the cold war, but alex there is no doubt that if russia has, in fact, engaged and entered ukraine, that that will increase these tensions, increase what has been a very frosty relationship between the united states and russia as of late. alex? >> you know, kristen, we spoke with national security adviser, ben rhodes, last friday, specifically about the issue of u.s./russian relation and ben revealed that the president had spoken to president putin on friday for an hour, which is quite a long time. >> absolutely. >> and i wonder if you've gotten any readout on the last time the two spoke, whether they spoke this week or just sort of where where they are diplomatically with the russians at this moment. >> with he don't have any indication they have spoke this week of course that is certainly possible that they have and we haven't got an readout of that phone call. but no word on them speaking
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over the past several days, but you're absolutely right to point out the fact that it was significant that the two leaders had that hour-long conversation, they had not spoke for quite some time and you recall that president obama cancelled a bilateral meeting that the two leaders supposed to have last year, that certainly was a snub. comes because there have been so many tensions between the united states and russia as of late, whether it be syria, iran, of course, edward snowden, so this is just one more thing, alex, adding to those tensions, the president trying to reach out to putin, urging him not to engage but it seems like that might not be the case now. >> kristen, stick with us, we are waiting for the president to speak in the white house briefing room on the ukraine in a few moments. we will bring you those remarks live when we get them. that's just ahead. nt to lug a e bunch of cleaning supplies. that's why he created the magic eraser extra power. just one eraser's versatile enough to clean all kinds of different surfaces and three times more grime per swipe.
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we urge all parties, all parties, that includes the new
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inter rim technical government and rightists and oppositionists and others, anybody in the street who is armed, any parties to avoid any steps that could be misinterpreted,ed three miscalculation or do anything other than to work to bring peace and stability and peaceful transition within the governing process of ukraine. >> that was secretary of state john kerry speaking earlier today on the situation in ukraine. we are waiting for president obama to speak from the white house about the crisis there. joining us now from the briefing room is nbc's peter alexander. peter, do we have any sense of what the president may address, how much of it will be an echo of what the secretary of state said earlier today? >> yeah alex, not exactly certain what we will hear from the president a short time now when he does walk into this briefing room, he will certainly echo some of the comments we have heard from other administration officials, including press secretary jay
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carney who is in room only a short time ago said, in the administrati administration's language, intervention is, as he described tax grave mistake. he also emphasizedz that the u.s. supports the territorial integrity and the sovereignty of ukraine. we have been reaching out to administration officials over the course of the day, trying to find out more information about those forces that have been entering crimea that region within ukraine today and u.s. administration officials, as you have reported, cop firmed that uniformed russian forces, apparently a hybrid of military and paramilitary forces, are still flying into that region today. they could not confirm the exact numbers, no reason to doubt the basic information that they are russians arriving on russian aircraft, as we speak right now. we expecterer the president may comment on a potential conversation he may have had with vladimir putin. the last time the two men spoke was exactly a week ago. make no mistake, these are
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severe, significant consequences that russia could face, whether they are militarily -- military consequences, it's clear the u.s. has little it could do in terms of military efforts at this time, alex, but obviously, the president on this stage wants to make it very clear that the u.s. is watching and there will be consequences. >> i want to -- thank you, peter. i want to swing over to the white house where nbc's kristen welker s kristen, what's interesting here is so much of our sort of main foreign policy priorities right now hinge on russian cooperation. that could be nuclear deal on iran, it could be some kind of resolution to the situation in syria. and there is a sense, i would love to know your thoughts on this, this white house has been a little more hesitant in and around certain issues because russia is such a major player in so many areas. certainly the white house feels like they have been -- they have to and must comment on this, given the situation over there. but one would expect that they are gonna thread a fairly careful line here, given the
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other priority at hand. >> well, i think that's absolutely right. and that has been a big criticism of this white house, of this administration, that they haven't been strong enough, that the president hasn't been strong enough on some of these foreign policy issues when you luke at a case like syria, for example, where he sort of walked up to the brink of taking military action and then decided to put that in congress' hands and then, of course, the administration was able to find another diplomatic route so that that became unnecessary. then on iran, a lot of people say the pending deal is not tough enough. so this is certainly another test for this president, for this administration it will be interesting so-to-see what specifically the president says, whether he uses stern words, more of the rhetoric we have been hearing or whether he actually threatens to take some type of action if he draws a red line, for example, alex, that's certainly something i will be listening for. alex? >> thank you, crisp.
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joining us now is the editor of politico magazine and resident putin whisperer, susan glasser. what is vladimir putin doing here in the olympics are over, the attention of the world is maybe less on russia than it was a week ago, but what do you think he is trying to achieve here? is this a just a show of force for his own sort of purposes or is -- do you legitimately think that some kind of occupation may be beginning? >> i think first of all, you have to not count out anything with vladimir putin. he has shown this is his own backyard and going to be very, very, aggressive here. this is not a kiss of international diplomacy and getting one up on the obama administration and syria or something this is literally in russia's, what it considers its historic sphere of influence and it has shown in the past that it is willing to use military force when necessary to enforce its -- itself in its sphere of influence. remember, it was the georgia war between russia and georgia when russia invaded georgia just a
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few years ago that spelled the low point of relations between the bush administration and vladimir putin. >> susan what do you make of the relationship between the president, president obama, and president putin at this point? >> well, you know, i would say that certainly, it's cooled off considerably from its starts and i think that, you know, there was talk of could we try to get these two leaders again back together for one-on-one meeting? that hasn't happened. president obama very visibly snubbed the sochi olympics which were meant to be the big show of vladimir putin's accomplishments in russia. canceled the meeting supposed to be held, the one on one meeting between putin and obama september. right now that relationship would be characterized as frosty at best. >> and what do you think this does measurably in terms of scuttling or complicating the deal with iran that the russians have been very active on in terms of its nuclear weapons program? >> well, i think that's an important point. remember, we can't just afford to ignore or freeze out russia,
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even if we very much disapprove of what they're doing in their own backyard and so that's very -- very complicated situation. i think we are gonna have to wait and see what president obama says right now. >> we are awaiting his word. politico magazine's susan glasser, thanks for coming in, pinch hitting. that is all for now. the ed show will pick up our coverage coming right up. good evening, americans, welcome to "the ed show" live from new york tonight. we are awaiting the president of the united states, his statement about the political unrest in the country of ukraine. now, the latest weres from the region say armed militants have occupied two airports in the area. members of the ukraine's government say the men were troops deployed from russia. the kremlin is denying these claims. earlier today, ukraine's ousted president,y. , speaking